Beltwood

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Beltwood

Postby Rebecca » 10 Dec 2004 12:33

Did anyone else know that Beltwood Mansion (next to Dulwich Wood House pub on Sydneham Hill) has become a night club:

http://www.beltwoodestate.com/
http://www.clubzone.com/home.asp?city=35

They claim: [i]This new upmarket venue housed British Royals and even the Beatles and it is ready to host the public at many hot parties and international DJ events[/i].

I don't understand how they got permission to have a night club in a residential area. They don't seem to have specific closing times and the local community don't seem to have been consulted.

Am I the only one who is surprised about this?
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Postby nasaroc » 10 Dec 2004 13:15

I must say that I'd never heard of this place either until recently. But looking at the wonderful things on their website and hearing about the place from other who have been there, surely we should welcome such a great venue to our area.

Presumably the night club isn't making much disturbance otherwise we'd have heard complaints from neighbours.

Why, oh why are we so quick to criticise almost any element of enterprise in our community? These people are trying to preserve a beautiful house - if they don't it'll be turned into flats or the grounds sold for development.

Good luck to them is my view. I'm heading straight up there for the next event!
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Postby GLOBAL THINKER » 10 Dec 2004 14:21

Wow - just had a look at the website and I'm going up there tonight to have a look around, it's set in 3.5 acres of ground so maybe noise will not be an issue for the surrounding residents. New Years Eve look pretty good though. I'll let you know.
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Postby areopagus » 10 Dec 2004 19:03

I agree it sounds like an exciting venture, and it makes one of the more extraordinary houses in Sydenham accessible to the public. I'm not able to get there, but would be most interested to hear what it's like.
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Postby megan » 11 Dec 2004 10:00

:shock: Having been involved in the club scene for some time now, having worked with many esteemed promotions including more recently Pacha in London's Victoria, the pictures frankly do not excite me at all. Pictures of ceiling coving, half a chicken dish and beer pumps do little to make me think that this is anything like a nightclub, and the £50 charge on December 17th is nothing more than ludicrous. If this is the best they can do to conjure up images of what is supposed to be a nightclub, it's frnakly scary. To give an example Kinkymalinki on NYE is charging £75 per ticket with FREE drinks all night, in a very plush Bishopsgate venue. Is this a case of Dulwich robbery????
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Postby megan » 11 Dec 2004 10:03

:shock: Actually looking at the other comments regarding this 'new' nightclub, i'd say that Global Thinker is connected with this venue, as he or she seems to be advertantly over advertising the place. How do you think that the website looks anything like exciting, and if you really are going NYE, then you really need to more!
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Postby megan » 11 Dec 2004 10:04

:shock: sorry the last bit says get out more!!!!
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Postby admin » 11 Dec 2004 12:50

Megan,

I hope you don't mind me saying this and maybe I have overinterpreted what you said.

But if you suspect GT of something - rather than appear to assert it - would it not be wiser just to simply ask the question - "Do you have an interest in the Club?"

Vigorous debate, diifferences of view is what we want so your criticism of their website is very welcome. But I wouldn't want this to escalate into personal attacks. This is strictly reserved for Lewisham's Traffic Planners :D
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Postby megan » 11 Dec 2004 14:34

I wasn't personally attacking this person, but having seen this venue just 2 weeks ago, I can report that it is in dire need of a total refurb, and we were actually shocked at how run down it had been. Unless a very quick refurb has been made, I find it unbelievable that anyone is actually trying to charge people to attend this place. That reason alone makes me suspect that these people are involved in the running of the place as their comments are just too over emphasising on the matter. And if so, that kind of defeats the impartiality of what these types of forum are about...If anyone has seen this place and differs in opinion I'd like to hear. And to Global thinker, are you involved?, and if you really will be going NYE, can you take a few snaps for all to see perhaps?
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Beltwood

Postby Beltwood » 11 Dec 2004 16:58

Hi Rebecca,

I am very happy to see that my PR efforts have managed to reach members of the public and especially those living in the area of Sydenham. I understand your surprise because the majority of our neighbours are not aware of the 5-year restoration project that has been happening under their noses. Beltwood Estate is fully licensed for every inch of its 3,5 acre listed property and even though the business is not a night-club, but rather a registered hotel, we are legally authorised to host various events ranging from weddings to conferences and parties. For all our exclusive music events, we will always endeavour to utilise the marketing tools available to us; such as websites like www.clubzone.com and www.webflyers.com, to ensure that we reach the customers that find our establishment suitable for their entertainment. I think you can firmly trust in the Lewisham Police Department and their abilities to keep Sydenham free from any illegal business operations in the area. Ours is completely legit and definitely promises loads of fun for the community.

Feel free to stop by and have a look!
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Postby Steve Grindlay » 11 Dec 2004 19:12

On a historical note, Beltwood was built in early 1851 (a couple of years before the Crystal Palace was erected here) by a London solicitor, Edward Saxton. At the time it was one of only seven houses along Sydenham Hill. Today, the only houses older than Beltwood are no.16 and no.18.

Saxton died at Beltwood in 1911, aged 97. It remained a private residence until after the second world war, the last private occupant, from 1927 to 1949, bearing the wonderful name of Athelstane Wilson Cornforth. Between about 1949 and 1962 it was the Sydenham Hill Babies' Hospital and from the mid 60s it was used by the YWCA.

Incidentally, when built the house was in Lewisham. In the early 20th century the boundaries were redrawn, placing it in Southwark.

The house is a surprising and well-preserved survivor from Sydenham's Victorian heyday, and as such should be cherished.
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Postby nasaroc » 12 Dec 2004 13:23

I think we should all agree that this is a matter of preference. If you find it over expensive or not interesting, then don't go there. I don't think a "country" house in the suburbs can be compared with a modern venue in town.
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Postby Rebecca » 13 Dec 2004 14:19

Megan - I totally agree with all your comments. Glad Im not alone!

Beltwood - I understand that you are due to receive a visit from the planning department in the next few days (if they haven't been already). I believe the council will also be checking that you have all the correct licenses in place.

I still think that if you market yourself on club websites, and advertise club nights on your own website, people will think you are a night club and not a hotel. You don't even give details of room prices on your website - which is a bit strange if you are a hotel.

I am not against the idea of a club / hotel in the local area. But I am against the idea that people can suddenly trade as a club in a residential area without any consultation from neighbours.

Regards
Rebecca
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Beltwood

Postby Beltwood » 13 Dec 2004 16:23

Hi Rebecca,

Our website is currently under construction and we basically only have a boring one-page reference online. Our hotel sells on top international hotel booking websites because we would need to hire a web-development team dedicated to optimising our website in various search engines if we were to sell our rooms ourselves. We have therefore opted for using the professionals who make an easy job of filling up our hotel.

I am not aware of a meeting with the Council, but they are more than welcome to visit us at any time. I believe that the Magistrate's Court would be the authority who deals with licensing so I'm surprised that it is the Council who wishes to check our licences (spelled with a "c").

Beltwood has for years been a party venue, but its large gardens and location has kept all its past activities quite secret. I find the fact that we are injecting life into the area quite exciting, but would also, for your peace of mind, wish to add that there will be no disturbance to neighbours. Lastly, I would just like to add that Beltwood has been a 5-year project and has not just suddenly errupted as a business from its ruins. I'm all for progress and moving forward towards a positive future in Sydenham!
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Re: Beltwood

Postby Rebecca » 13 Dec 2004 16:38

[quote="Beltwood"]I believe that the Magistrate's Court would be the authority who deals with licensing so I'm surprised that it is the Council who wishes to check our licences.[/quote]

Unfortunately this is not the case. Unless all the guests are hotel residents, you will require an entertainment license from Southwark Council. Your advertising does not mention that guests must being staying at the hotel.
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Beltwood

Postby Beltwood » 13 Dec 2004 17:48

Very strange, Rebecca. I met with the Licensing Officer for our area earlier today and we were discussing that the Council will only be taking over licensing for our property late next year.

You seem to have a lot of time to spend on Beltwood matters, so if you would like to correct him, I would be happy to PM his details to you because I am far too busy organising our party on Friday. In fact, if you could put me in touch with the correct Council authority that should really be handling our licensing, I would be most grateful.

Let it be known to all on this forum that if BELTWOOD finds there is any discrepancy in conforming to any of our legal requirements to operate as a business, we will gladly work towards correcting the problem. So, please feel free to submit your comments as kindly as Rebecca has.

All the best,
Janine
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Postby admin » 13 Dec 2004 18:30

Sorry Private Messaging is disabled on this board - but Beltwood's email address is on their website if anyone wants to take up any issue directly.

Dare I say to everyone - can we keep this discussion cool?
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Postby GLOBAL THINKER » 16 Dec 2004 10:45

I have only been off work for 3 days and I come back to accusations of courting publicity for Beltwood! I had never heard of the place before reading Rebeccas posting.
As my previous message clearly states I was due to go up there and have a look around (which I didn’t get a chance to). Can I assure Megan that I am not way affiliated or deal with Beltwood in any capacity.
As readers of my posts know I am all for new ventures and enterprises in Sydenham and the surrounding areas. I do not need to get out more (admittedly I would like to do more travelling!!) I get out more than enough thanks, just because I do not fit into Megans idea of what is “trendy” and “cool” does not invalidate my opinions or beliefs. The importance of this forum cannot be underestimated and should not be drowned out with personal attacks and false accusations. Lets stick to the issues at hand.
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Beltwood

Postby Sandie » 16 Dec 2004 13:13

Thanks to Rebecca who has highlighted this venue that is right on our doorstep. Initially I felt the admission prices were quite high (but then perhaps I don't get out much either!) but after considering that there is nominal travelling - time and money, I feel pretty lucky to have such an important house open to the general public who can hear live music. I'm sure that no-one is going to such great expense on refurbishing this large property to forgo the necessary lisences in order to remain open. I have on occasion seen a number of cars parked around there but have been completed in the dark as to why. I will be going along with husband and friends to visit Beltwood in the New Year. Thank goodness somebody has realised the importance of the property and not allowed its disintegration. Again Thank you Rebecca for the info. :wink:
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Postby dave » 16 Dec 2004 18:08

I'm with rebecca on this, If I was to know that there is a night club starting to operate just around the corner from me, I would not have bought a flat here. I don't like the idea of the area becomming a gathering ground for crusties and weirdo's with glo-sticks. I think it's a joke that this can happen without even putting up a notice to local residents.

Sorry to the crusties and glo-stick lovers reading this. It's not my intention to have a go at you. :twisted: :twisted:
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