CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

The place for serious discussion, announcements and breaking news about Sydenham

Moderator: frenzarin

leenewham
Posts: 5886
Joined: 2 Sep 2007 11:58
Location: SYDENHAM
Contact:

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by leenewham »

I have to say from my OP I'm warming to it, I'm quite excited about it, but it's all about the details.

They are working up a lather in Crystal Palace though and some are getting a bit upset with comments like 'it will set a precedent for building on parks, what if they build a B&Q on Peckham Rye'. They obviously haven't noticed the sports stadium and tower block in the park or seen any old pictures of it!

If it's done well, it could be incredible. But it could also be a disaster.
Likelife
Posts: 147
Joined: 20 Jul 2009 14:21

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by Likelife »

michael wrote:
I think the real opportunity if the capacity of existing railways is not good judged to be good enough, would be to get a large contribution to the cost of a Bakerloo line extension underground linking Elephant and Castle to Peckham, Horniman, Upper Sydenham, Crystal Palace, Penge, and Beckenham.
I just don't see the need for a Bakerloo line extension to Beckenham whether that's underground via Palace or via Lewisham on the Hayes Line. I'd rather those billions of pounds going to the railways making more capacity for more services.

The idea that parks are under attack is nonsense. What park in London has been built on? Anyway the palace was there originally, without the palace the area would still be called Sydenham Hill! And where its planned to be in the park isn't exactly the Garden of England - is half concrete. Oh and the Syd Society should listen to what the residents actually want, not what they think we want.
leenewham
Posts: 5886
Joined: 2 Sep 2007 11:58
Location: SYDENHAM
Contact:

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by leenewham »

The thing I'd like to know is what they will do with the million of tons of rubble on the site. After WW2 the basement of the palace was filled in with bombed buildings and cars from the blitz. You entered on the first floor, at the back there were quite steep steps.

It's a really interesting archaeological dig potentially but a huge cost for the groundworks. It's one of the main reasons my OP was against it.

I agree with your post Lifelike.
Eagle
Posts: 10658
Joined: 7 Oct 2004 06:36
Location: F Hill

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by Eagle »

Yes let us get behind this great scheme. I was ashamed to see the usual suspects , moaning minnies , who never want any change.

Congratulations to the Chinese gentleman. Rather like it took an American to rebuild the Globe , it will take a Chinese Gentleman to rebuild the Palace.

Re transport. Can we look at re building the High Level Station and Line. I know some parts disgracefully built on , but a lot of the track area remains un built up.
mosy
Posts: 4098
Joined: 21 Sep 2007 20:28
Location: London

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by mosy »

I'd suggest that if "various restrictions" were to be resolved such that the plan can go ahead, rubble in the basement is probably the least worry. It'd be "modern" rubble anyway wouldn't it being post mid-1800's which is well represented in various museums already?

Does the land belong to the Crown incidentally?
Maybe Queenie can have the final say :D It'll create lots of jobs in the planning offices in the run-up (that taxpayers do foot the bill for but that gets peeps off benefits so a sort of quid pro quo).
Eagle
Posts: 10658
Joined: 7 Oct 2004 06:36
Location: F Hill

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by Eagle »

This is a brown field site. Cannot see planning a problem. They are replacing like for like.

As far as I am aware Bromley Council own the land. Why would the Crown own it? It was never a Royal Palace , in the sense monarch's resided there.

Let us hope give express clearance so building can start soonest. Great employment for local unemployed.
michael
Posts: 1273
Joined: 26 Sep 2006 12:56
Location: Forest Hill

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by michael »

Eagle wrote:Re transport. Can we look at re building the High Level Station and Line. I know some parts disgracefully built on , but a lot of the track area remains un built up.
Fine if it is underground, but not using the existing above ground route. Apart from the homes that would need to be removed, much of the route is through woodland and nature trails - it would be a shame to destroy these. But tunnel from Elephant and Castle to Crystal Palace for the Bakerloo line would be perfect and would only cost a few billion more than a surface level line.
Eagle wrote:This is a brown field site. Cannot see planning a problem. They are replacing like for like.
It is Metropolitan Open Space, so it is no longer defined as brown field. Generally it is not easy to build on Metropolitan Open Space, but it is possible if it is for the right reasons.
Eagle
Posts: 10658
Joined: 7 Oct 2004 06:36
Location: F Hill

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by Eagle »

Michael

I appreciate the High Level Station area has been destroyed many years ago. I do not think restoring trains through wooded areas would destroy the open space?

Cannot understand why building ever permitted. It usually was agreed when lines closed that the permanent way would be sacred.

If High Level Station could be restored we could open up the lovely tiled tunnels.
mosy
Posts: 4098
Joined: 21 Sep 2007 20:28
Location: London

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by mosy »

michael wrote:[...clip...]
It is Metropolitan Open Space, so it is no longer defined as brown field. Generally it is not easy to build on Metropolitan Open Space, but it is possible if it is for the right reasons.
Or possibly have the specific palace footprint (being at the perimeter) taken out of MOL status, given that whilst the plan probably meets primary MOL requirements, it seems it might fail by needing to be self-funding, as I read the guidelines.

Probably years of Vicky Pollard "Yeah but no but yeah..." - I'll stay optimistic :mrgreen:
Steveofsyd
Posts: 306
Joined: 23 Feb 2013 19:05
Location: Wiverton Road

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by Steveofsyd »

We'll I won't be moving sometime soon. A good reason to hang on to the house. Sydenham is already running ahead of the market...

[ Post made via Mobile Device ] Image
Eagle
Posts: 10658
Joined: 7 Oct 2004 06:36
Location: F Hill

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by Eagle »

A house , or flat , should be somewhere to live . Not something you worry about the value of constantly.
paultreacy
Posts: 487
Joined: 10 Jun 2008 17:40
Location: Lawrie Park Road

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by paultreacy »

Spent some time looking over this thing last evening and I'm rather excited by it.

I must try to get access so that I can document it. Hmmm.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ] Image
Eagle
Posts: 10658
Joined: 7 Oct 2004 06:36
Location: F Hill

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by Eagle »

Yes Paul looks very impressive. Trust there will not be any of very few objections from the usual suspects.
Manwithaview1
Posts: 2162
Joined: 21 Jan 2012 21:23
Location: Sydenham Hill Estate

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by Manwithaview1 »

Eagle wrote:Yes let us get behind this great scheme. I was ashamed to see the usual suspects , moaning minnies , who never want any change.

Congratulations to the Chinese gentleman. Rather like it took an American to rebuild the Globe , it will take a Chinese Gentleman to rebuild the Palace.

Re transport. Can we look at re building the High Level Station and Line. I know some parts disgracefully built on , but a lot of the track area remains un built up.
The High Level line would have to terminate at Upper Sydenham but that realistically is a non starter. A better rail connection between Penge East and West might be better. A bus service via PE to Crystal Palace would help as well.
Tim Lund
Posts: 6716
Joined: 13 Mar 2008 18:10
Location: Silverdale

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by Tim Lund »

Does being on a hill mean constructing a large, deep terminal underground terminal / interchange is relatively feasible? Thanks to Crystal Palace being so important a destination historically, it is already a bus interchange. An undergound link to the remaining CP station, now also on Overground would make a lot of sense.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ] Image
Manwithaview1
Posts: 2162
Joined: 21 Jan 2012 21:23
Location: Sydenham Hill Estate

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by Manwithaview1 »

Tim Lund wrote:Does being on a hill mean constructing a large, deep terminal underground terminal / interchange is relatively feasible? Thanks to Crystal Palace being so important a destination historically, it is already a bus interchange. An undergound link to the remaining CP station, now also on Overground would make a lot of sense.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ] Image
Would extending the Victoria line be the better option than the Bakerloo line? Brixton - Herne Hill - Tulse Hill - Paxton Green/Gypsy Hill then CP Lower Level.
Eagle
Posts: 10658
Joined: 7 Oct 2004 06:36
Location: F Hill

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by Eagle »

Seems everyone in favour. Just discussing the transport links.

What a plus for the area.
Steveofsyd
Posts: 306
Joined: 23 Feb 2013 19:05
Location: Wiverton Road

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by Steveofsyd »

Eagle wrote:A house , or flat , should be somewhere to live . Not something you worry about the value of constantly.
I don't worry Eagle, but it's nice to have that security in knowing that we are ahead of the market.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ] Image
Nigel
Posts: 2412
Joined: 22 May 2005 16:12
Location: Laurie Park

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by Nigel »

At this point I don't know if I will be for or against but I am amazed at how so many of us seem to react to a very unformed proposal from an overseas businessperson , with the backing of Boris Johnson - without any sense of the whole picture .
For me the announcements such as they are , are premature and very presumptuous .
I really don't know how many people would actually welcome a copy of the crystal palace , similarly , inevitable commercial developments on the site .

Very happy to be proved wrong but I think this proposal is seen as some kind of free money solution to a longstanding problem . It does not surprise me to see the political class lap this up , but I am taken aback by the unquestioning welcome so many on this forum have expressed .

I look forward to hearing more , in the meantime I am wholly neutral .
Good evening
Nigel

[ Post made via Mobile Device ] Image
Tim Lund
Posts: 6716
Joined: 13 Mar 2008 18:10
Location: Silverdale

Re: CRYSTAL PALACE PLANS TO BE UNVEILED

Post by Tim Lund »

Being wholly neutral is easier if distractions such as nationality, ethnicity and political label are discounted.

[ Post made via Mobile Device ] Image
Post Reply