Zanzibar- Licence revoked

[Eagle]

True I am probably a lot older than you.

Problem occurs in the small hours when Lewisham do not employ wardens . There are night buses but people seem to insist on driving, I wonder how many would pass drink /drug tests when they leave.

Re Litter surely the extra litter created should be cleared by those responsible, either the anti social patrons or the people making money out of them.

Not sure why 11pm should be too early . Guess most people have to get up to work in the morning .. Occasional midnight
on Sat'days , but that is still late for noise

There are plenty of Pubs in Sydenham where people could go.

[bensonby]

While you can see the problem with this:
I move to London because of buzzy nighttimes, I am rich and manage to move to the most buzzy area, I then complain about the noise. It's not nice is it? All this noise? I didn't expect this?

That's detrimental to lots of organisations and institutions that provide fun to people

May I draw your attention to the law as stated in Sturges v Bridgeman (1879) and confirmed in Miller v Jackson (1977).

If a venue causes a nuisance it is irrelevant that someone "came to the nuisance".

[SteveG85]

Demeaux

You may be new to the area, so perhaps have not grasped the suffering inflicted on locals by the Zanzibar nightclub over a sustained period of time. I have copied a few links for you below.

http://www.newsshopper.co.uk/news/14134 ... e_revoked/

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=12434

https://sydenham.org.uk/forum/viewtopic ... 6&p=102774

I may be wrong, but it looks like your comments above regarding Car Parking and Litter are suggesting that the most straightforward way to solve the problems outside Zanzibar would be: 1) Lewisham to use our council taxes to employ traffic wardens to specifically stand outside Zanzibar at 2am on Sunday morning or TFL to upgrade local public transport; and 2) To re-educate society so that people no longer litter. I would humbly suggest that a more efficient approach to solving the problems outside Zanzibar would be for a responsible management team to be put in place at the venue.

I don't understand the relevance of your comment regarding how long Eagle has lived in Sydenham. An uncharitable interpretation would be that you were trying to say that the reason Eagle doesn't favour the patrons of a poorly managed nightclub repeatedly waking up and intimidating hundreds of locals is that he isn't "buzzy" enough.

You then group The Dolphin, The Golden Lion and Beer Rebellion together with Zanzibar. That is ridiculous. It is perfectly consistent for locals to welcome well managed businesses such as those you list, but to dislike Zanzibar.

[Nigel]

SteveG85 , extremely well put .
This " afraid of change " accusation is too frequently bandied . I've never heard Eagle disparage those other new pubs/ refurbishments and I would guess he welcomes them, as do I .
Lots of venues take an active role in minimising disruption but the " management " of Zanzibar did not seem to care until revocation stared them in the face whereupon they got the inane Lee Jaspers in to call objectors racist .

I appreciate the interest in a night time economy and would welcome a good vene but when something is irredeemably bad, like Zanzibar , step one is get rid of it and start again.

A very good afternoon
Nigel

[Eagle]

Thanks Nigel.

You are entirely correct.

Pro Dolphin and Beer Rebellion. Have not been in GL for long time.

[demeaux]

That's not really what I was saying. I'm being quite subtle I agree. I'm saying:

If a business person moves to make something a club, they should consider the neighbours. Just like if people move next to a club and start complaining about the noise. That's fair isn't it?

I'm also saying the way people behave outside of the club, throwing litter etc is not the chicken shop or nightclub owners fault. That's the customers showing poor citizen and social skills.

I recognise that eagle is a long term resident, as evidenced by his knowledge of the old department store. I'm saying that Sydenham is changing, it's changed, and that's because people are moving here (like other parts of London). I asked what kind of venue would be acceptable.

I'm not being rude.

[demeaux]

I really don't think you could put a night venue in where Zanzibar is without causing upset.


What I was trying to say as well was, why should some people say a venue closes at 11 and that's late enough?

[bensonby]

Just like if people move next to a club and start complaining about the noise. That's fair isn't it?

Unfortunately the law doesn't agree with you on that point, as per my earlier case law I quoted.

As for your point re any nightspot getting complaints if it were to be located there: I don't think there were huge problems when it was "Twighlights". Unless someone could correct me?

[tonyhorse]

It's excellent that this place is not allowed to continue. Sydenham doesn't need a rowdy nightclub like this. It is an up and coming area and doesn't need this sort of establishment. Maybe reopen in Lewisham?

[Robin Orton]

Sydenham [...] is an up and coming area and doesn't need this sort of establishment. Maybe reopen in Lewisham?

Welcome to the forum, tonyhorse. But......gosh!

[Pally]

It's excellent that this place is not allowed to continue. Sydenham doesn't need a rowdy nightclub like this. It is an up and coming area and doesn't need this sort of establishment. Maybe reopen in Lewisham?

Oh ...so the residents there can put up with the noise?????? Its either ok or it is not!!!!

[tonyhorse]

Point taken. Then I think they should just leave nightclubs to central London entertainment. No need to infect the area with a late night drunken mob atmosphere.

[monkeyarms]

I used to live slap-bang opposite Brixton Academy and also very close to the nightclub Plan B, in Brixton. Lived there for 10 years. So that's around 3000 nights of musical revelry ending between the hours of 10.30pm and 3am that I completely slept through. It never once disturbed or inconvenienced me.

So is perfectly possible to run a nightclub in a mixed-use or residential area. You just have to have a responsible management that makes an effort. Zanzibar doesn't/didn't.

[Eagle]

Monkey Arms

If I recall correctly the problem is not the noise in the actual venue but the wholesale disruption and vandalism when they leave.

Apparently most of the punters drive when there is patently very little , if any , legal parking available . Also cannot believe many for the drivers would not fail drug and alcohol tests after the event.

[monkeyarms]

Yes, indeed. I've never understood the point of driving to a club (or live music venue or pub for that matter).

I posted the above really to make the point that, were a different club with an entirely different approach to take on the lease, I would not object to their application for an entertainments/alcohol license, because I know that it can be done conscientiously and responsibly.