The Monstrosity - ie St Philp Neri school building

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syd
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The Monstrosity - ie St Philp Neri school building

Post by syd » 24 Mar 2018 11:48

Hello, there is a school extension in on Sydenham Road which look like it belongs in a out of town shopping centre......in the late 1980's. Does anyone know how it passed planning? I don't wat to be rude but It's comically bad.

admin
Site Admin
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by admin » 24 Mar 2018 17:40

That's the St Philip Neri catholic primary.

syd-gal
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Location: Sydenham

Re: The Monstrosity

Post by syd-gal » 24 Mar 2018 19:30

I've been watching its construction. It came up quite quickly. I wonder what the children now do seeing that they've lost their playground.

Larky
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by Larky » 25 Mar 2018 09:30

They are using the rear playground and also Home Park

EUSSR
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by EUSSR » 25 Mar 2018 10:51

theyre letting kids out to play in a playground :shock: ...Sounds a bit dangerous...

JRW
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by JRW » 26 Mar 2018 23:49

I live as a neighbour of the St Philip Neri school in Fairlawn Park, and am appalled by its design quality. It is the kind of structure you expect on an industrial estate, not in such a prominent position. Lewisham Council has let us down appallingly over this development, especially after a notable improvement in the build quality of new developments locally.

The school is benefitting from the other site being sold, as they are vastly increasing the pupil numbers by bringing the infants to share the main site. Given this, surely it is reasonable to expect that they spend a tiny proportion of that fund in making their new school slightly less ugly for their neighbours.

JRobinson
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by JRobinson » 27 Mar 2018 15:04

I didn't think it was finished yet...?
if not, then there will probably be some cladding of some sort?

should we wait till we know it's finished before passing judgement?

Sideofham
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Location: Kirkdale village

Re: The Monstrosity

Post by Sideofham » 27 Mar 2018 15:43

I say give it time, The Eiffel Tower and Tower Bridge were initially hated by everyone but now they are iconic landmarks recognised the world over, St Philip Neri catholic primary may finally put Sydenham on the world stage.

Jollylolly
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by Jollylolly » 27 Mar 2018 16:56

There will still be a playground. Just in a different place. The prefabs at the back will be demolished and the smaller playground there made bigger. There are plans to have greenery on the roof and they are putting new trees in. They have changed the outside material from the original plans which is a shame as I agree it is now a bit uglier. I am also a Fairlawn resident and although it’s not the prettiest (worse for people in flats directly opposite on sydenham road than Fairlawn) I really hope that it can be a worthwhile addition to the community and perhaps having an entrance to Home park will encourage improvements there and get more people using our community library. I see it as a positive change... my only concern being the resulting increase in nutty school run driving! That’s a whole other thread though!

JRW
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by JRW » 27 Mar 2018 18:14

I agree it looks as if it is unfinished, but the scaffolding is going, so it looks like that's it. Enjoy! BTW, there is a roof terrace open air classroom, so the noise will carry over the nearby houses.

Sydenham Syd
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by Sydenham Syd » 29 Mar 2018 11:50

JRW wrote:I live as a neighbour of the St Philip Neri school in Fairlawn Park, and am appalled by its design quality. It is the kind of structure you expect on an industrial estate, not in such a prominent position. Lewisham Council has let us down appallingly over this development, especially after a notable improvement in the build quality of new developments locally.

The school is benefitting from the other site being sold, as they are vastly increasing the pupil numbers by bringing the infants to share the main site. Given this, surely it is reasonable to expect that they spend a tiny proportion of that fund in making their new school slightly less ugly for their neighbours.
I have to say it is a pretty grim looking building, although I have a couple of kids there and thankfully they will benefit from the new spec that was long overdue - there are going to be a couple of playgrounds btw. It's a vast improvement facility-wise and the design internally is really going to be superb from the looks of it.

The external aesthetics cannot be considered superb IMHO. This was a veto put down by the diocese apparently. I'm not completely clear on the situation, but the original design had timber struts on the front and some further brick work, similar to the school up Perry Vale on the right. I am led to believe that the diocese rejected those plans and just sent down this design that looks like a pre-fab. I think its ghastly outside, but internally it is a massive upgrade and a huge improvement for the kids.

Jollylolly
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by Jollylolly » 29 Mar 2018 13:27

Yes the planning letter we received stated that the original designs had materials unsuitable for school environment but reading between the lines they probably didn’t know who would maintain/clean the greenery in the troughs that were going to be in the brick work. Local residents were given a chance to object to the change in the cladding. I have received a letter every time a change has been made.

JRW
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by JRW » 30 Mar 2018 21:04

You are fortunate to be getting letters and notifications. I haven't had one, and I live opposite. I keep telling them and they keep ignoring it.

JRW
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by JRW » 5 Apr 2018 15:53

Good news for Fairlawn Park: on 27 March 2018, the Head of Planning, Emma Talbot, issued a
'Refusal of Permission to Develop' notice on the site of St Philip Neri school.

The reason for refusal is that:
'The proposed external materials would, by reason of their appearance, quality and fixing method, resulting in a poorly detailed and incongruent building harmful to local character and contrary to Policies 15 High quality design for Lewisham of the Core Strategy (June 2011) and Development Management Local Plan (November 2014) DM Policy 30 Urban design and local character.'

This document is found at
http://planning.lewisham.gov.uk and search with planning reference number,DC/18/105610, click on the Documents tab, and the decision was made on March 27th. Currently at the top of the list.

I am not a lawyer, but it sounds to me as if we might get a chance to improve the exterior of the Monstrosity; the developer has completely altered the materials for the facade agreed in the planning permission, and gone for the cheapest possible option. School parents, don't panic, the school is going nowhere, but the developers need to talk to Lewisham planning, and to us, so we can end up with an acceptable result, or at least something better than an industrial estate shed.

Nigel
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by Nigel » 5 Apr 2018 17:18

Excellent news - whilst I’m sure everyone supports the needs of schools there is no excuse for developers sacrificing good design and finish so they can pocket a few more quid for BMWs , hot tubs and dodgy porches or whatever these Philistines spend their money on .
I think we can celebrate some recent new architecture in Sydemham , The Orb is s good example in my view , but so glad people have not entirely given up on beauty and good design as standard .

A very good evening
Nigel

parker
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by parker » 5 Apr 2018 17:34

JRW wrote:Good news for Fairlawn Park: on 27 March 2018, the Head of Planning, Emma Talbot, issued a
'Refusal of Permission to Develop' notice on the site of St Philip Neri school.

The reason for refusal is that:
'The proposed external materials would, by reason of their appearance, quality and fixing method, resulting in a poorly detailed and incongruent building harmful to local character and contrary to Policies 15 High quality design for Lewisham of the Core Strategy (June 2011) and Development Management Local Plan (November 2014) DM Policy 30 Urban design and local character.'

This document is found at
http://planning.lewisham.gov.uk and search with planning reference number,DC/18/105610, click on the Documents tab, and the decision was made on March 27th. Currently at the top of the list.

I am not a lawyer, but it sounds to me as if we might get a chance to improve the exterior of the Monstrosity; the developer has completely altered the materials for the facade agreed in the planning permission, and gone for the cheapest possible option. School parents, don't panic, the school is going nowhere, but the developers need to talk to Lewisham planning, and to us, so we can end up with an acceptable result, or at least something better than an industrial estate shed.
Did the Sydenham Society intervene. If so, credit where it is due.

JRW
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by JRW » 5 Apr 2018 22:08

I don't know about the Sydenham Society's involvement, but at the Sydenham Assembly a group of Fairlawn Park residents talked with Cllr Liam Curran about the exterior, and he seemed very concerned. I followed this up with an email, and he may well have taken action. A group effort, let's say.

I will post against when there is more info on the process to decide on new cladding.

syd
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Location: lower sydenham

Re: The Monstrosity

Post by syd » 6 Apr 2018 09:44

That’s great news :D

Let’s hope future developers take note Sydenham ain’t what it used to be!

Newtosydenham
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by Newtosydenham » 6 Apr 2018 12:09

I am so glad to hear this, thank you for sharing.

It baffles me how a new buildso unimaginative and architecturally unimpressive can be given approval. There was so much potential! It really is such a shame. I was hoping it would be like the CoE school in forest Hill or some of the new academies. I truly hope that the council stand strong and they are not allowed to get away with changing the spec.

JRW
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Re: The Monstrosity

Post by JRW » 7 Apr 2018 15:14

The thing I find most puzzling about the whole design is - what purpose do the fake gables serve? Looking at the plans. I was surprised to see it screens a flat roof with solar panels and some green roof, and a light well. It doesn't look as if the kids have access to this bit, so why an extra storey of bulk? It would have been far less dominating if they had toned down that '80s visually illiterate styling and kept it simple. Gables need detail to make them look convincing...... Stick them on a tin shed and the whole thing looks preposterous! Sorry. End of rant....

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