New St Christopher's Charity Shop

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syenhamboy
Posts: 89
Joined: 26 Aug 2016 03:33

New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by syenhamboy » 14 Jun 2018 15:17

To open in the old betting shop on the corner of Newlands Park.

I for one think that St Christopher's is an outstanding Hospice and Charitable organisation and I fully support their cause and good work.

However Sydenham is now a high street of Charity Shops, Estate Agents and Pound Shops.
It seems that these are the only businesses that thrive in our dwindling high street. Am I wrong?

mosy
Posts: 3853
Joined: 21 Sep 2007 20:28
Location: London

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by mosy » 14 Jun 2018 16:50

I wish St Christopher's well too :)

Charity shops are good both altruistically and to counter that everything is now built for short term disposable use (save the planet) if things can be re-used or up-cycled.

Also, much better than the ignominy of having a prime corner site like Newlands Park being left vacant indefinitely. Plus with unrealistic rent and rates (charities get some concessions I think) they're probably the only ones who can even afford to run a shop.

It's not that you are right or wrong sydenhamboy is it? More I think that there already is a fair selection of regular footfall shops. What you call pound shops and I call home/hardware shops are rarely empty by the way..

So the trick would be a business which is "different" but still attracts sufficient repeat business to survive - at least until councils come to their senses and reduce small shop business rates, maybe coupled with a suitable regional cap on shop rents to avoid a reduction in rates being swallowed up by increased rents. If businesses are still shy even then, my worst fear is that we'll be dependent on a handful of uncontrollable corporates, having to shop via car or bus or online, buy only what they offer and gawd help us if they fail (too many eggs in one basket).

parker
Posts: 554
Joined: 26 Mar 2009 21:15
Location: Sydenham Wells

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by parker » 14 Jun 2018 17:11

So Yoga Studio fell through for this site then?

JMLF
Posts: 574
Joined: 12 Dec 2013 19:41
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by JMLF » 14 Jun 2018 19:25

I’ve emailed moreyoga to see what’s happening as would be a real shame if that didn’t work out especially if due to the ridiculous hoops/barriers the council seem to put in or at the very least not be actively supporting new, different, functional businesses wanting to be in Sydenham (the same issues have been raised/discussed what seems like hundred of times for various reasons).

Obviously, the other potential specific yoga studio would be great/supply that particular aspect however the corner spot is a real pivotal site for the high street I feel and would be great for something different/new to exist there breathing further new life to the middle of the high street much as Greyhound / Nando’s / Mama Dough / Blue Mountain (now Cobbs Corner) refit is doing up top.

Additionally it does say “pop-up shop” so I would assume from the wording that it’s not currently being seen as a permanent fixture.

TredownMan
Posts: 155
Joined: 28 Sep 2017 15:38
Location: Sydenham

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by TredownMan » 14 Jun 2018 19:44

Please keep us posted what you hear! Fingers crossed. It would be a real boost to the street.

syenhamboy
Posts: 89
Joined: 26 Aug 2016 03:33

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by syenhamboy » 16 Jun 2018 09:29

Looks like the yoga studio is going to be at Zanara Court


Shame this forum rotates the image
Click link below for right way round.

http://huluh.co.uk/yoga.jpg

Image

syenhamboy
Posts: 89
Joined: 26 Aug 2016 03:33

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by syenhamboy » 16 Jun 2018 09:33

parker wrote:So Yoga Studio fell through for this site then?

see my post

parker
Posts: 554
Joined: 26 Mar 2009 21:15
Location: Sydenham Wells

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by parker » 16 Jun 2018 10:41

syenhamboy wrote:
parker wrote:So Yoga Studio fell through for this site then?

see my post
But at one point there were two separate applications for yoga studios, one for the site of this new St Christopher’s shop and another for Zanara Court.

There’s a whole other thread all about this, but I can’t remeber where it was.

The question still remains, is this second application for a yoga studio (site of new St Christopher’s) still going ahead or has it fell through? The new St Christopher’s shop had been mentioned above as just a pop up after all.

sparticus
Posts: 221
Joined: 25 Jan 2013 13:56

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by sparticus » 16 Jun 2018 17:34

syenhamboy wrote:To open in the old betting shop on the corner of Newlands Park.

I for one think that St Christopher's is an outstanding Hospice and Charitable organisation and I fully support their cause and good work.

However Sydenham is now a high street of Charity Shops, Estate Agents and Pound Shops.
It seems that these are the only businesses that thrive in our dwindling high street. Am I wrong?
You couldn't be more wrong:

Four pubs catering for most tastes from the dedicated alcoholic to the cask beer and haloumi sarnie market
Superb Italian restaurant
Good indian
Fried chicken and kebab shops if that's your thing
Two decent chippies
At least four chemists/pharmacies (never worked that one out really)
The best mediterranean food shop ever
Knighton Motors
Poodle Club (just)
Bookshop
DIY emporium
A couple of good hardware/general goods shops
A cobbler
Traditional greengrocer
Good butcher that makes really good sausages and fishmonger
Banks
Baker and cake shop
Health food shop that sells excellent bread
Haberdashers
Halal butchers
Funeral directors
Two good grog shops
Post office (sadly under threat)
Brewery! soon to have a brewery tap
"Traditional" greasy spoons
Coffee shops
Stationers
I could go on, but hey, let's value and celebrate one of the few remaining high streets that has a wide range of independent business where almost all one's everyday needs can be satisfied.

JMLF
Posts: 574
Joined: 12 Dec 2013 19:41
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by JMLF » 16 Jun 2018 22:58

Indeed the corner spot (where this “pop-up” will be) was originally meant to be taken on by “more yoga” and the Zanara Court venue by “dragonfly yoga”. More yoga are more established and have opened a host of studios across London without the same difficulty as here over the last year or so (they mentioned this to me back when the original application was rejected - there’s another thread all about that ludicrousness) and then the other studio’s application came in at a later date.

Still no word on developments of either but here is hoping one of them becomes successful in opening at some point.

JGD
Posts: 554
Joined: 5 Feb 2018 11:39
Location: Perry Hill, SE6 (yup that's Catford)

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by JGD » 17 Jun 2018 10:34

Nicely and succinctly done sparticus.

Looks very different when you put it that way.

JRW
Posts: 346
Joined: 18 Jun 2015 15:01

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by JRW » 17 Jun 2018 13:46

I am not sure the building would be ideal for yoga anyway. Its corner position, on a busy junction with traffic lights, along with the extensive windows and low roof could make it noisy and hot. You couldn't even open a window because if the traffic fumes. I am all for lots of yoga, but think it's not a great choice, and the company may have had second thoughts about the idea. The added competition from a rival in a much better site could have been the last straw.

SydenhamOwl
Posts: 93
Joined: 20 Jan 2017 15:26
Location: Sydenham

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by SydenhamOwl » 19 Jun 2018 09:52

sparticus wrote:
syenhamboy wrote:To open in the old betting shop on the corner of Newlands Park.

I for one think that St Christopher's is an outstanding Hospice and Charitable organisation and I fully support their cause and good work.

However Sydenham is now a high street of Charity Shops, Estate Agents and Pound Shops.
It seems that these are the only businesses that thrive in our dwindling high street. Am I wrong?
You couldn't be more wrong:

Four pubs catering for most tastes from the dedicated alcoholic to the cask beer and haloumi sarnie market
Superb Italian restaurant
Good indian
Fried chicken and kebab shops if that's your thing
Two decent chippies
At least four chemists/pharmacies (never worked that one out really)
The best mediterranean food shop ever
Knighton Motors
Poodle Club (just)
Bookshop
DIY emporium
A couple of good hardware/general goods shops
A cobbler
Traditional greengrocer
Good butcher that makes really good sausages and fishmonger
Banks
Baker and cake shop
Health food shop that sells excellent bread
Haberdashers
Halal butchers
Funeral directors
Two good grog shops
Post office (sadly under threat)
Brewery! soon to have a brewery tap
"Traditional" greasy spoons
Coffee shops
Stationers
I could go on, but hey, let's value and celebrate one of the few remaining high streets that has a wide range of independent business where almost all one's everyday needs can be satisfied.
Skim read this so apologies if you said them but I would add...

Budget supermarket
Tesco
Polish food shop

Growsydenham
Posts: 97
Joined: 27 Jan 2018 09:23
Location: sydenham

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by Growsydenham » 20 Jun 2018 12:54

The Zanara Court application has also been withdrawn, it says on the planning website.
So are we getting one studio, two, or zero? It's not clear.

Pally
Posts: 1459
Joined: 2 Aug 2014 05:38
Location: Sydenham

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by Pally » 20 Jun 2018 13:41

I wonder why both have been withdrawn! Does anyone know of a way to find out?

JMLF
Posts: 574
Joined: 12 Dec 2013 19:41
Location: United Kingdom

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by JMLF » 21 Jun 2018 17:17

I emailed dragonfly yoga (zanara court location) only a few days ago regarding something not directly related but the response was they can’t confirm anything but if it was to go well they would hope to be open towards end of the year. Guess something could’ve happened in last few days with llandlord/council/other but no idea.

Unfortunately moreyoga (ladbrokes) sent me this disapponting message which is a horribly lovely example of difficulties people have who actively want to invest in the community only for barriers to be put up (see previous examples with threads on the yoga studio rejection, Nando’s malarkey etc.) rather than actively working with businesss who are bringing something different to the high street/community as well as filling an empty shop.

See below:

Thanks for the email

Sadly, I do not think we will be opening the site at Sydenham.

Due to the council rejecting our application, the landlord decided to go with another tenant as the property had been empty for 3-4 months.

While we got planning accepted on the second attempt, we tried pursuing the landlord to then find out the property was already in legal

We are still looking for other sites in the Sydenham area

Regards,
Daniel @MoreYoga

Growsydenham
Posts: 97
Joined: 27 Jan 2018 09:23
Location: sydenham

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by Growsydenham » 21 Jun 2018 18:47

JMLF wrote:I emailed dragonfly yoga (zanara court location) only a few days ago regarding something not directly related but the response was they can’t confirm anything but if it was to go well they would hope to be open towards end of the year. Guess something could’ve happened in last few days with llandlord/council/other but no idea.

Unfortunately moreyoga (ladbrokes) sent me this disapponting message which is a horribly lovely example of difficulties people have who actively want to invest in the community only for barriers to be put up (see previous examples with threads on the yoga studio rejection, Nando’s malarkey etc.) rather than actively working with businesss who are bringing something different to the high street/community as well as filling an empty shop.

See below:

Thanks for the email

Sadly, I do not think we will be opening the site at Sydenham.

Due to the council rejecting our application, the landlord decided to go with another tenant as the property had been empty for 3-4 months.

While we got planning accepted on the second attempt, we tried pursuing the landlord to then find out the property was already in legal

We are still looking for other sites in the Sydenham area

Regards,
Daniel @MoreYoga
Insanity!

I can't blame the council though. Everyone knows they grief and protests they get if things aren't done by the book, to the letter. Is it any surprise that such an atmosphere results in good things getting choked?

JGD
Posts: 554
Joined: 5 Feb 2018 11:39
Location: Perry Hill, SE6 (yup that's Catford)

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by JGD » 22 Jun 2018 06:23

The council could have dealt with this in a very different fashion.

As LB Lewisham had done with other retail applications in Sydenham, they could have granted the approval with conditions that required the submission of satisfactory Sounds and Traffic statements for subsequent approval by the planners. We can see other applications that are at fit-out stage now that were granted this flexibility.

As can be seen from the proposal the applicant moved forward in good faith only to find that the initial rejection by the planners had cost the prospective new business the opportunity to secure the tenancy.

It is this inconsistency on the planners part that is intolerable.

mosy
Posts: 3853
Joined: 21 Sep 2007 20:28
Location: London

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by mosy » 22 Jun 2018 13:19

JGD, whilst I agree with you in principle, surely it is also incumbent on a would-be business to make sure they provide the information required for planning approval and also to assure a prospective landlord that they are "a desirable good quality reliable lessee" to want and want to wait for if expecting to be a long-term lessee.

What you suggest implies that the council is supposed to hand-hold applicants, e.g. by their picking up the phone, which it isn't nor these days does it have the staff to nurture applicants. The onus is on the would-be applicant to pick up the phone before submitting an application, since once submitted the council has no alternative but to react to it as submitted.

The above assumes that the council is correctly applying whatever rules apply.

The Clown
Posts: 367
Joined: 8 Apr 2005 14:04
Location: Sydenham

Re: New St Christopher's Charity Shop

Post by The Clown » 23 Jun 2018 05:01

I hope St Christopher’s do something nice with the facade - it is such a prominent corner on the High Street. It would be great if it looked super smart.

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