how to get out of this mess

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angela53
Posts: 180
Joined: 18 Aug 2009 21:38
Location: london

how to get out of this mess

Post by angela53 »

the cure for covid is worse than the disease
The numbers of death are so small compaired to the uk population as a whole
lets wake up to this mess
I recommend talk radio the home of common sense
Stop being terrified of the uk media propoganda
stuart
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Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by stuart »

You are so right Angela. What are a paltry 100,000 Covid-19 related deaths by the end of the month? Why - without all that silly distancing and masks - it would still have been only a million or so.

We should be thinking bigger. Why not cull everyone over 60 and maybe all those black and brown people who insist on contracting it sooner? That would reduce 90% of hospital admissions/deaths at a stroke and allow all those nurses and doctors fly off to Tenerife for a nice sunny rest. Oh and save billions on pensions. No need for any jabs. Do you think that would go down well with your mates over on TalkRadio? Or possibly ComedyCentral?

Bon voyage,
Stuart
squashst
Posts: 64
Joined: 5 Mar 2011 12:01

Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by squashst »

Yes, I agree the "let COVIS rip" concept is nonsensical and would lead to the collapse of the NHS which would impact cancer treatment etc.

What I think should be said though that there is no good outcome when something like COVID19 happens, any action will have adverse impacts. On R4 last year there was a series of excellent programmes on the Spanish Flu 1919 pandemic and it was noted that the health and economic impacts carried on through the 1920s. So it definitely will be with COVID19 through the 2020s.

Basically supporting a lockdown means that you (and I) accept that there will be impacts re mental health, domestic abuse, suicides. If the lockdown lasted long enough, then parts of the economy will tank, with further malign impacts.

In short I believe lockdown is a lamentable catastrophe. So should all of us.

Yet I support lockdown at the present time. Why - to avoid a worse catastrophe (with gangrene sometimes you have to cut off an arm to preserve a life). I just hope that the vaccines work. If not there would be a choice between letting rip or carrying on lockdowns ad infinitum. Both truly catastrophic.

Its a shame that politicians can't be honest and acknowledge that there is no good outcome only the least worst.
chrisj1948
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Location: Sydenham

Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by chrisj1948 »

stuart wrote: 4 Jan 2021 00:00 We should be thinking bigger. Why not cull everyone over 60 .....
If you consider 'Society' as a unit there is a certain logic to this. Feed and educate the young well. Provide good housing and healthcare for them and the workers. Eliminate any members who are no longer productive but still require a disproportionate share of the resources. Fortunately society is not such a unit and ethical considerations prevail; a great relief to those of us who would be ripe for culling!
stuart
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Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by stuart »

chrisj1948 wrote: 4 Jan 2021 10:41... a great relief to those of us who would be ripe for culling!
I'm guessing from your moniker that you are knocking on 73 and hence a tad over-ripe. Ah, that ethical thing is such a pain. Otherwise common sense folk might consider culling TalkRadio listeners would be a better idea ...

HNY,
Stuart
Parker1970
Posts: 453
Joined: 4 Nov 2014 22:36
Location: Kirkdale

Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by Parker1970 »

stuart wrote: 4 Jan 2021 10:59 . Otherwise common sense folk might consider culling TalkRadio listeners would be a better idea ...

HNY,
Stuart
Timely.... YouTube kicks TalkRadio from it's platform, seemingly because of covid-19 misinformation
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-55544205
syd
Posts: 360
Joined: 23 Aug 2006 18:30
Location: lower sydenham

Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by syd »

FYI new covid is 10-100 times more infectious, no one knows the true number at this point.

In simple terms 1 person with new covid is like 10 - 100 people with old covid breathing and coughing in your personal space. Not only are there more particles they are more easily attached to receptors.

This is why we are in lockdown until probably summer and banned from the rest of the world.

It is unbelievably serious and to have some people dismiss it as no big deal is a disgrace.
2.  An analysis of 641 COVID-19 cases found "S-negative" (B.1.1.7 inferred) cases had 10 to 100-times higher nasal viral loads than 'regular' COVID-19. Virologically, that is a massive difference. It could easily explain higher transmissibility.
doi.org/10.1101/2020.1…
Here is the paper from the BMJ and Yale university

https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101 ... 834v1.full
gurka
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Joined: 21 Jul 2009 15:05
Location: South East

Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by gurka »

I was in the lower Sydenham Sainsbury's a little earlier today and OMG the amount of people wheezing, coughing and not wearing masks was just surreal , if this new strain is much more infectious then I hope the mythical person in the sky (What ever god you believe in) will help us as knowing people that work at Lewisham and the Pru hospitals it's going to be horrendous over the next few months.
syd
Posts: 360
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Location: lower sydenham

Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by syd »

gurka wrote: 5 Jan 2021 20:20 I was in the lower Sydenham Sainsbury's a little earlier today and OMG the amount of people wheezing, coughing and not wearing masks was just surreal , if this new strain is much more infectious then I hope the mythical person in the sky (What ever god you believe in) will help us as knowing people that work at Lewisham and the Pru hospitals it's going to be horrendous over the next few months.
When you've got people on talk radio pretending its a hoax this is what happens. Also the on the BBC its played down and is not the lead story. I think herd immunity is still the plan whatever the cost.
JGD
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Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by JGD »

Shocking figures emerging today (Wednesday) about the acceleration of spread of the virus in South East London.

From a figures of a few weeks ago where it was reported that approx 1 in 900 people were infected, we went to bed last night being told 1 in 50 is now the ratio.

Unfortunately since last night the figures have been revised and it is now reported to be 1 in 30.

Both ratios are deeply shocking to come to terms with.
syd wrote: 6 Jan 2021 00:19 When you've got people on talk radio and the Angela's pretending its a hoax this is what happens.
We are all becoming increasingly aware, first hand, of the numbers of our families, friends and acquaintances who have been infected, some who have become seriously unwell and some of whom have lost their lives.

What type and volume of evidence do the deniers, hesitants and non-conformants need?

Evidence of their owns eyes when they are wheeled into ICU in a bed and can observe the sufferers and dying around them?

Get in the game - give yourself a chance of survival - do what you can when you can - observe the rules.
syd
Posts: 360
Joined: 23 Aug 2006 18:30
Location: lower sydenham

Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by syd »

JGD wrote: 6 Jan 2021 09:06 Shocking figures emerging today (Wednesday) about the acceleration of spread of the virus in South East London.

From a figures of a few weeks ago where it was reported that approx 1 in 900 people were infected, we went to bed last night being told 1 in 50 is now the ratio.

Unfortunately since last night the figures have been revised and it is now reported to be 1 in 30.

Both ratios are deeply shocking to come to terms with.
syd wrote: 6 Jan 2021 00:19 When you've got people on talk radio and the Angela's pretending its a hoax this is what happens.
We are all becoming increasingly aware, first hand, of the numbers of our families, friends and acquaintances who have been infected, some who have become seriously unwell and some of whom have lost their lives.

What type and volume of evidence do the deniers, hesitants and non-conformants need?

Evidence of their owns eyes when they are wheeled into ICU in a bed and can observe the sufferers and dying around them?

Get in the game - give yourself a chance of survival - do what you can when you can - observe the rules.
This is what it takes

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/worl ... edium=Feed

The rules are probably out of date for the new variant. Im using n95 masks if i have to go out.
prince
Posts: 232
Joined: 23 Mar 2016 17:57
Location: London

Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by prince »

It appears people like yourself are symptomatic of the problem we are now facing. Careless disregard for the most vulnerable in society. People who fought in world wars for the freedom that you and everyone else enjoys. Disregard for those with long term health issues. Obviously disposable to you.

I truly hope that COVID doesn’t seriously affect someone you love. And don’t forget that for every bed taken caring for people with COVID that is taking support and care away from others who are in desperate need of life saving treatments! Again this could be someone you love or even yourself.
angela53
Posts: 180
Joined: 18 Aug 2009 21:38
Location: london

Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by angela53 »

I think you are a bit out of date Parker 70
Talk radio was back up and running within 24 hours with an extra channel, no case to answer, activist cancel culture fail
angela53
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Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by angela53 »

As an NHS clinical worker, I am not a "covid denier" but I am concerned about the collapse of the economy that pays for the health service. I know several people who have had covid and all have recovered like almost everyone else.
There will be a lot more people dying from missed cancer diagnosis, delayed treatment and not to mention suicide following
business failure. The government have so far got no sense of getting the balance right between health and the economy.
syd
Posts: 360
Joined: 23 Aug 2006 18:30
Location: lower sydenham

Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by syd »

angela53 wrote: 7 Jan 2021 19:41 As an NHS clinical worker, I am not a "covid denier" but I am concerned about the collapse of the economy that pays for the health service. I know several people who have had covid and all have recovered like almost everyone else.
There will be a lot more people dying from missed cancer diagnosis, delayed treatment and not to mention suicide following
business failure. The government have so far got no sense of getting the balance right between health and the economy.
2008 bank bail out £500bn

2020/2021 covid costs £214bn

Maybe do some research I find facts quite useful

Ps thank goodness there was no clapping on my road.
angela53
Posts: 180
Joined: 18 Aug 2009 21:38
Location: london

Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by angela53 »

National headlines "NHS overwhelmed" claimed every year, except this year they have ignored the fact that 13000 beds nationally have been taken out due to social distancing rules, equivalent to 5 hospitals. 85,000 NHS staff off on self isolation due to over cautious track and trace rules including NHS app highlighting contact with covid patients due to failure of staff switching their phones off while in work, not forgetting tens of thousands of patients who have tested positive for covid a week after being admitted for other reasons
angela53
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Location: london

Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by angela53 »

thanks syd
syd
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Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by syd »

It’s totally insane that as an #NHS doctor, I still have to tweet the fact that the #COVID19 pandemic is not a hoax and the current surge is likely to overwhelm large parts of the NHS. The next few weeks are going to be extremely difficult and COVID deniers aren’t helping matters
angela53
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Location: london

Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by angela53 »

Hi Syd

Can you explain what point are you making in your last post ?

Thanks
angela53
Posts: 180
Joined: 18 Aug 2009 21:38
Location: london

Re: how to get out of this mess

Post by angela53 »

I repeat I am not a covid denier however there are many shroud waving doctors who exagerate for the benefit of their departments over other rival departments in their hospital
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